Controverted Point: That what is given here sustains elsewhere.

Theravādin: Your proposition commits you to the further statement that robes, alms-food, lodging, medical requisites for ailments, hard food, soft food, and drink, given in this life, are enjoyed in the after-life—which you deny … And it commits you further to this heterodox position, that one person is the agent for another; that the happiness or ill we feel is wrought by others; that one acts, another experiences the consequences—which you deny … .

Rājagirika, Siddhatthika: You deny our proposition. But do not the Petas thank him who gives a gift for their advantage, are not their hearts appeased, are they not interested, do they not obtain gladness? Was it not said by the Exalted One:

“As water rained upon high slope
Doth ever down the hillside run,
E'en so whate'er on earth is given
Doth reach the hapless Peta shades.
And as the brimming rivers run
To keep the mighty ocean full.
E'en so whate'er, etc.
For where they dwell no husbandry
Nor tending daily kine is there,
No merchant traffic as with us,
No goods to buy with precious coin.
By what is given here below
They share who, dead, 'mong Petas go”?

Therefore our proposition is right.

Again, was it not said by the Exalted One:

“Bhikkhus, there are these five matters which parents, if wishing for a child to be born to them, contemplate. Which are the five? Cared for (they think) he will care for us; or, he will do our work; he will continue our family; he will inherit our property; he will institute offerings to the departed parent shades (Petas).

“Wise folk who fain a child would have
Have five advantages in view:
Us by his wages he will keep;
His will it be our work to do;

Our family will long endure;
Our heritage to him we leave;
And then again an offering
To Peta-shades he'll institute.
These matters five keep well in view
The wise who fain a child would have.
Wherefore the pious and the good,
Children who know and grateful feel,
Support their mother and their sire,
Remembering all these did for them.
Their tasks they take upon themselves,
E'en as their parents toiled for them;
Do their behests and them maintain,
Nor suffer that their race decay.
Praise to the child of filial heart,
With piety and virtue dight”?

Was it not so said? Then is our proposition right.